|Posted 06/15/2007 - 09:02:51 AM by bassmanO8:|
|Posted 06/15/2007 - 09:06:02 AM by thepuffin:|
|Oh, I actually thought this article was going to be about the music. So much for expectations. As far as the music is concerned, Oasis won the battle but Blur won the war. Now go read Phonogram.|
|Posted 06/15/2007 - 09:54:03 AM by meatbreak:|
|Actually Puffin, I think it's the other way around. Blur won the battle: Country House going to number 1 and Roll With It getting the number 2, but Oasis are still going and are, inexplicably still very popular. Blur's ignominious implosion and break up has been followed by Damon's inhuman efforts to be as smug and tuneless as possible. I shall never forgive him for making me hate him so. Blur lose, Ughasis win, as pained as I am to admit it. Terrible, terrible article though. Why write this: "Trendy music critics like myself, however, have pretty much brushed it under the carpet, so we can talk about hip bands like Rage Against the Machine and the Propellerheads."? WHY?!!!|
|Posted 06/15/2007 - 10:05:15 AM by persyeux:|
|Oh people relax.|
|Posted 06/15/2007 - 10:35:58 AM by meatbreak:|
|Nah man, the whole premise of these 'Vs.' things is that there's a fight to be had. Which bit are we supposed to relax over? All good fun, all good fun.|
|Posted 06/15/2007 - 10:38:41 AM by J_R_K_:|
|definetly thought pulp was going to win.|
|Posted 06/15/2007 - 10:56:07 AM by thepuffin:|
|I respect your opinion, meatbreak, but mine is based on Oasis having two great records which were followed by a batch that recycled their formula over and over. Blur's Great Escape (one of their weaker efforts) against What's the Story (one of Oasis' strongest) produces a clear winner in my book. Hence the battle being won by Oasis at the peak of BritPop. But Blur's catalogue as a whole trumps Oasis' body of work. Blur continued to evolve their sound from record to record, making them the winners of the war in my book. Or maybe, Pulp won.|
|Posted 06/15/2007 - 11:20:11 AM by meatbreak:|
|Well, I actually agree with you on all those points Puffin, except that The Great Escape was their weaker album - that's just a big fat NO WAY! In many respects it's an even closer examination of British cultural sterotypes (and not just the song either), middle class mindset and modern life than Parklife was. I was thinking more of public opinion (and cash) as the barometer, but I forget I'm in the arena of the critic rather than the common record buying civilian (for a minute there, I lost myself). In terms of quality of albums Oasis never came any where near to writing anything like as beautiful a song as This Is Low, To The End, Best Days or The Universal. They are pretty much all heartwrenching. In terms of rockin' out, Blur win hands down (or Up! Up! Up!) too, though that's where the handful of great tracks off Definately Maybe start to make their presence known. Graham Coxon is by far the greatest guitarist of the Britpop era if you ask me (hmmm..maybe joint with Johnny Greenwood, but not for the purposes of this article). No way Noel could ever come up with Beetlebum or Popscene. Yeah, Pulp won.|
|Posted 06/15/2007 - 11:21:09 AM by meatbreak:|
|This Is A Low. Obvious, but I had to correct it.|
|Posted 06/15/2007 - 01:30:02 PM by analogdivide:|
|There is a glaring omission, as far as the Best Parody category is concerned. Bob & David's Smoosh from Mr. Show might have swung the balance back over to Oasis in that race.|
|Posted 06/15/2007 - 01:45:33 PM by nickneek:|
|I agree with thepuffin this article is awful. The worst blur vs oasis article in the history of blur vs oasis articles. It reads like a bad issue of Holy Moly... Why bother rolling out the same dull jokes that everybody has made since 1995? By the way, I think you mean Liam, not Noel in the 'The Females' section.|
|Posted 06/15/2007 - 04:14:57 PM by AKMoose:|
|Erlewhine is my least favorite music critic of all-time, and unrelentingly awful both in his writing and his opinions. Why invoke him?|
|Posted 06/15/2007 - 05:30:32 PM by cwperry:|
|Posted 06/15/2007 - 05:31:23 PM by cwperry:|
|J_R_K_: Hee hee!!!!!!|
|Posted 06/16/2007 - 12:17:45 PM by papercuts:|
|Hey Meatbreak If by greatest guitarists of Brit-pop, you mean in terms of sludging wankery, then I would agree with you about Graham Coxon and Jon Greenwood. If you mean greatest in terms of being memorable, economic, and melodic then I have to go with Noel Gallagher on this one, which reflect his entire songwriting catalog as a whole. Same could be said about Coxon and Greenwood (the sludgy wankery part that is), in terms of their respective catalogs.|
|Posted 06/18/2007 - 07:13:24 AM by raskolnikov:|
|Very good Bassman08! Now yer talkin' some sense at last!|
|Posted 06/18/2007 - 04:08:44 PM by bassman08:|
|Except you're forgetting, meatbreak, that Blur won the OVERALL war by actually making good music and solid albums consistently THROUGHOUT THEIR CAREER. Their self titled albums is one of my favorite ever, and I;m not ashamed to say it.|
|Posted 06/18/2007 - 04:09:49 PM by bassman08:|
|Oh yes, and besides, Supergrass win by default anyway. Sorry, Pulp.|
|Posted 06/19/2007 - 07:26:14 AM by meatbreak:|
|Hey Bassman, I'm not forgetting that Blur are the far superior band at all, and I too have Blur pretty far up my favourite albums, ahead of all the other Blur albums. I think I pretty much said that they were a consistently excellent band. I have no idea what Papercuts is talking about with his 'sludgy' nonsense and Noel's 'memorable, economic, and melodic' songwriting skills. Sorry, what? Stolen/familiar = Memorable; Lack of vision = Economic; Running out of faint praise = Melodic. I'm at a loss. Did you just imply that Noel Gallagher was a great guitarist? That's going to keep me going for weeks. And Mr Puffin, when you take The Great Escape and compare it to What's The Story, you're comparing 3rd and 2nd albums, so really you should compare Leisure with Definately Maybe, then Parklife with ...Story. Pedantic for sure, but in terms of a winner in the artistry, it's got to be Blur - There's no other way.|
Supergrass make superficially endearing pop music. Nothing more.
I vote Menswe@r.
|Posted 06/19/2007 - 08:25:46 AM by bassman08:|
|Yeah, i actually din't read your entire conversation just the first one. And Meanswe@r. Haha. I'm glad they didn't catch on here in the States. They sound retarded.|
|Posted 06/19/2007 - 11:08:08 AM by meatbreak:|
|Bollox, not Parklife as Blur's second album, obviously: Modern Life Is Rubbish. I meant that! I'm making a right balls up of this, huh? Point still stands though. Where's the Chemical World or Villa Rosie off What's the Story?|
|Posted 06/22/2007 - 09:19:30 AM by papercuts:|
I didn't IMPLY that Noel Gallagher is a great guitarist, I in fact SAID it. |
Stolen/Familiar? I thought that this defined ALL BRIT-POP!!! I've always felt that first and foremost Brit-pop was defined by it's wearing of past british influences shamelessly on it's sleeves. This in and of itself doesn't make this form of music bad, but let's just be honest with ourselves here. There is nothing new or innovative in anything Blur and Radiohead have done.
|Posted 06/22/2007 - 09:44:34 AM by meatbreak:|
|You say that, but then you consider Noel Gallagher the superior guitarist? I agree with you that a large part of britpop was all about the influences, but Coxon and Greenwood developed those influences and created some really individual sounding tunes and interesting ideas. Noel just isn't capable of producing anything like Essex Dogs, Death Of A Party or This Is A Low for example. In terms of economy (urgh, bad word but I do know what you mean) and melody To The End and End Of A Century, for example, are such beautifully concise songs with tangible atmospheres, the vital element missing from most Oasis songs, except maybe Champagne Supernova and Cast No Shadow, but the lyrics in those are so bad they detract from it. The only individual thing Oasis had going for them was Liam whether you consider him consummate Rock & Roll frontman ot twat or not.|
As for Radiohead never contributing anything innovative to the British music canon, well that's an entirely different issue and one that comes unstuck as soon as you press Play on Kid A.
|Posted 06/22/2007 - 10:09:54 AM by papercuts:|
|The only thing that comes unstuck when I hear Kid A is the fact that Thom Yorke ripped off the Warped Records catalogue and noone seemed to mind.|
Tangible atmospheres? I'm glad you mentioned that because Oasis had this going for them all over the Standing on the shoulder of giants(1999) album. A flawed album to say the least, however, I put it way higher then anything from 13, released that same year. "Sunday Morning Call" and "Gas Panic" are some of the most sonically ambitious tunes that Brit-pop ever produced. As for your assertion about lyrical content, this may sound like a cop-out but I've never been one to take it much for granted, unless it's something that happens to leap out of the song right at me. And you're right about Liam being a tops frontman. Like the old cliche goes, he is definitely one who could read the yellow pages and make it sound good.
|Posted 06/22/2007 - 10:32:07 AM by papercuts:|
|Er, DOESN'T come unstuck, that is.|
|Posted 06/22/2007 - 10:58:33 AM by meatbreak:|
|Oh man, come on. Since Wimbledon is nearly upon us is it remiss of me to say YOU CAN NOT BE SERIOUS!!!? I don't think 13 is an especially great album either, but it's leagues ahead of the lumpen SOTSOG. Those songs you mention aren't sonically ambitious, they are only ambitious for a derivative and unexploratory band like Oasis. You're not one of those people that still looks forward to new Oasis releases are you? Did you buy the Proud Mary album? I don't want to come over all antagonistic, but I'm getting the impression you might consider Hindu Times to be a giant leap into the nebulous world of psychedelia. But yeah Liam could make the Yellow pages sound good, and on closer inspection you'd probably find the words to be a damn sight more interesting and insightful than most off their records. It is a bit of a cop-out to ignore lyrics, but we're not talking about those anyway, I shouldn't have brought them up. It was a cheap shot.|
|Posted 06/22/2007 - 01:13:18 PM by papercuts:|
|Yes, I'm also one of those Oasis fans who like Kylie Minogue and the Dave Matthews Band, who also gets his film education from what is on Burger King Collectible Mugs. Right.
Actually, I know a diamond in the rough when I see one and refuse to go with the Status Quo who are brainwashed to believe that Oasis did nothing of value after their second album.
By the way, when is Blur's new album coming out? Which Atari 2600 game sound effects will Graham be emulating on the guitar? I bet whatever it is will be innovative. Will Damon Albarn be taking another trek to Morocco to study Jajouka music just like Brian Jones did 40 YEARS AGO?? Also, isn't the new Radiohead album coming out shortly? Will Thom be moaning on and on and on and on about raindrops and sucking lemons again? I can't wait..opps, was that a cheap shot?
|Posted 06/23/2007 - 07:52:10 AM by bassman08:|
|The fact that I had to resort to Wikipedia to remember SOTSOG's no 1 single (much less the ful album title) says something about that album when you compare it to 13. Granted, 13 isn't that great but it has Coffee and TV. A no-brainer. I probably couldn't hum a tune from anything after 'What's the Story' (and I've heard most of the albums since then, at least in passing). In conclusion: Damon and Alex may be fucktards but they still make more memorable music than the equally fucktarded Ghallager bros.|